Under what conditions do subs use their towed array? Is it only when they are slowly trawling for contacts, then they retract it during combat?

 

Bump

Under what conditions do subs use their towed array? Is it only when they are slowly trawling for contacts, then they retract it during combat?

 

Yes, generally speaking, the towed array is useful for trying to obtain early detection of contacts while moving relatively slowly in deep water.

 

If you think you'll need to move at high speed or maneuver, i.e. to evade enemy torpedoes, you might want to retract the towed array to avoid breaking the line.

 

More recent US Navy towed arrays, such as the most recent variants of the TB-16 and TB-29, are more tolerant of high speeds.

Under what conditions do subs use their towed array? Is it only when they are slowly trawling for contacts, then they retract it during combat?

 

Yes, generally speaking, the towed array is useful for trying to obtain early detection of contacts while moving relatively slowly in deep water.

 

Could this be the one of the reasons for the sprint-and-slow movement combination of naval forces when moving in uncertain tactical conditions? Move like a herd of elephants, then slow/stop to listen. A short security halt in infantry parlance.

How often would a submarine do a 180, and clear baffles? Once every 30 minutes, an hour, or longer (4 hours?)?

How often would a submarine do a 180, and clear baffles? Once every 30 minutes, an hour, or longer (4 hours?)?

 

Don't know. Possibly on a fairly random basis.

How often would a submarine do a 180, and clear baffles? Once every 30 minutes, an hour, or longer (4 hours?)?

 

How long is a piece of string? Dependent totally on the mission and the conditions, both tactical and environmental.

Somebody knows something about the russian SOKS (earlier called Kolos) non-acoustic submarine detection device ?

It's implementable in the papel rules or PC game ?

 

I think it may be irrelevant, too, I see in World Naval Weapons Systems (Norman Friedman) : "The soviets experimented extensively with non-acoustic submarine detectors, apparently with no great success".

Some mentions in: http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/archive/i...hp?t-48279.html

SOKS is a very sensitive (for its time) "keel-water wake detection system" (Sistema Obnarujenia Kilvaternovo Sleda) derived from the first Soviet torpedo-mounted systems. During Operation Aport the K-147 (a "clean" 671 fitted with the SOKS and the experimental MNK-100) managed to follow a Lafayette-class (probably Simon Bolivar) SSN for more than 6 days (other sources say it was a Los A. SSN, but it's hard to believe). The point is: you can't detect anything just with the SOKS, you need (passive) acoustics as well (because of basic physics) and the whole thing's name is MNK-100: the wake of a sub changes the density of the water, filling it with microscopic bubbles. This effect can last for hours and hours, so you need to go through a complex process of measuring these parameters when they're still detectable through acoustic (passive) and hydrooptical means (as it seems that trying to detect this effect by measuring the relative salinity values has not proved reliable).

Somebody knows something about the russian SOKS (earlier called Kolos) non-acoustic submarine detection device ?

It's implementable in the papel rules or PC game ?

 

Not something that could be modeled in the current HCE mode, and I haven't seen it mentioned in terms of the H4 paper rules, but certainly the latter are generally easily able to accommodate such things, as long as you can come up with or agree to a set of performance criteria.

In my Harpoon 4.1 data annexes i cannot find Mk67 533mm TT torpedoes. The Los Angels subs have them listed as an armament, but i cannot find the data on them under Annex F torpedoes. Any suggestions?

In my Harpoon 4.1 data annexes i cannot find Mk67 533mm TT torpedoes. The Los Angels subs have them listed as an armament, but i cannot find the data on them under Annex F torpedoes. Any suggestions?

 

Those are the tubes that hold the torpedoes, not the weapons themselves so you won't find them in an annex. Look to the notes on the submarine entry itself for firing info (which will probably come down to the generation of the electronics where # of torpedoes at a time is laid out). iirc it is two torps for the early LAs, all four tube for later LAs.

In my Harpoon 4.1 data annexes i cannot find Mk67 533mm TT torpedoes. The Los Angels subs have them listed as an armament, but i cannot find the data on them under Annex F torpedoes. Any suggestions?

 

Those are the tubes that hold the torpedoes, not the weapons themselves so you won't find them in an annex. Look to the notes on the submarine entry itself for firing info (which will probably come down to the generation of the electronics where # of torpedoes at a time is laid out). iirc it is two torps for the early LAs, all four tube for later LAs.

 

So for an LA Class SSN typically 20x Mk48 torpedo and 6x Harpoon. (Page A-43 H4.1 Data Annex)

So Mk67 is a tube and Mk 48 is the torpedo? Okayyyyyy.

So Mk67 is a tube and Mk 48 is the torpedo? Okayyyyyy.

 

Blame the US Navy.

So Mk67 is a tube and Mk 48 is the torpedo? Okayyyyyy.

 

Yep. "Mk67 533mm TT" means Mk67 533mm (21 inch) Torpedo Tube. Mk 67 is the designation of the launcher, and Mk 48 is the weapon or projectile. Just like Mk 140 and Mk 141 are launchers for the RGM-84 Harpoon missile; like Mk 112 is a launcher for RUR-5 ASROC; etc, etc.

 

It may seem scary, but there are also further designations for almost every single piece or component of those individual weapons, launchers, sensors, etc. For example, within that Mk 48 torpedo mentioned above ...

 

Mk 72 transducer

Mk 83 transmitter

Mk 68 receiver

Mk 1 Homing Control Logic (HCL)

Mk 107 warhead

Mk 21 exploder

Mk 2 arming group

Mk 12 electronic assembly

Mk 154 or Mk 168 command control unit

Mk 155 gyro control unit

Mk 156 Power Control Unit (PCU)

etc

 

All makes perfect sense.