Is there a definite number for ESM range in Harpoon? 500 nm? Double the the range of the receiver's radar?

Is there a definite number for ESM range in Harpoon? 500 nm? Double the the range of the receiver's radar?

 

That's a good question, Victor. I don't recall offhand if there is a set maximum or a set formula, and as you know, the actual detection range varies according to the altitude and strength of the radar. Perhaps Tony can dig up that little tidbit for us.

 

In the meantime, here's another point that might have been lost in the shuffle and may have a bearing on being detected when you don't think there are any enemies around that could: Installations also have ESM.

Is there a definite number for ESM range in Harpoon? 500 nm? Double the the range of the receiver's radar?

 

That's a good question, Victor. I don't recall offhand if there is a set maximum or a set formula, and as you know, the actual detection range varies according to the altitude and strength of the radar. Perhaps Tony can dig up that little tidbit for us.

I was wondering if there was any maximum range of the ESM, too - because there might be situations where I sought to avoid ESM detections.

 

In the meantime, here's another point that might have been lost in the shuffle and may have a bearing on being detected when you don't think there are any enemies around that could: Installations also have ESM.

If you're referring to bases, then I was actually assuming that the bases were the platfomrs that were utilizing ESM to detect my assets when I didn't expect it... and also caused me to wonder why my own side couldn't seem to manage that.

 

Regarding detection in general, one thing that I didn't take into account were the effects of weather and daylight on visual detections... yet it still goes back to howcum they can see us when we can't see them (under the same ambient conditions, whatever those may be at the time). Seems to me it should be at least roughly comparable.

Harrier II GR.7 and 9 have DATA's of 40, while most of the other Harriers are 20, for example.

 

Thanks for pointing that out. Its an error. Harrier DATA should be 15 across the board. I will fix this for the next iteration of the database. In most cases the Loadout DATA was already correct.

Harrier II GR.7 and 9 have DATA's of 40, while most of the other Harriers are 20, for example.

 

Thanks for pointing that out. Its an error. Harrier DATA should be 15 across the board. I will fix this for the next iteration of the database. In most cases the Loadout DATA was already correct.

 

Thanks for the answer on the E-2B. The light bulb came on in my head when I launched the RA-5C and ESM came up from everywhere, while the E-2 didn't have it, so I started checking DB stuff. I noticed the Harrier stuff after what Tony posted about DATA and such.

That's a good question, Victor. I don't recall offhand if there is a set maximum or a set formula, and as you know, the actual detection range varies according to the altitude and strength of the radar. Perhaps Tony can dig up that little tidbit for us.

 

Tony says ESM detects out to a maximum of 1.1 times the radar's line of sight.

 

So, for example:

 

An emitter (active radar) and a receiver (ESM) are both at Low altitude, where the radar line of sight (LOS) is 78 nm.

 

The maximum distance at which the ESM can detect the emitting radar is 85.8 nm (or, 1.1 x 78).

 

If at Medium altitude, where radar LOS is 135 nm, max ESM detect range is 148.5 nm.

 

And at High altitude, where radar LOS is 271 nm, max ESM detect range is 298.1 nm.

Is there a definite number for ESM range in Harpoon? 500 nm? Double the the range of the receiver's radar?

 

In the meantime, here's another point that might have been lost in the shuffle and may have a bearing on being detected when you don't think there are any enemies around that could: Installations also have ESM.

 

As I interpret this, all those SAMs and what have you that are scattered around the base, some of which are much closer to the plane than the actual base is, are also capable of detecting the radiating Hawkeye.

... yet it still goes back to howcome they can see us when we can't see them (under the same ambient conditions, whatever those may be at the time). Seems to me it should be at least roughly comparable.

 

They can't. It is. This is definite.

Tony says ESM detects out to a maximum of 1.1 times the radar's line of sight.

 

Ah, good. Since radar range due to LoS (Earth's curvature effect) from high to ground is about 250 nm, we can now say that ESM could pick up the plane at about 275 nm. Add 25 nm for the attached ground units.

 

Therefore, if the radiating Hawkeye at high altitude is within 300 nm of either Vietnamese base proper, then it will be detected by ESM. Further away, it is below the horizon.

Effective ESM was only added from the E-2C Hawkeye variant.

I would even suspect that ESM ought to be seriously affected by jamming. But, as I said, I'm no expert in the matter - by any means.

 

Actually, that brings me to a question: In HCE, do jammers set off ESM detection? i.e. can you detect/locate the jammer from its emissions? Or is that not modeled?

 

 

 

Harrier II GR.7 and 9 have DATA's of 40, while most of the other Harriers are 20, for example.

 

Thanks for pointing that out. Its an error. Harrier DATA should be 15 across the board. I will fix this for the next iteration of the database. In most cases the Loadout DATA was already correct.

 

Ah, I didn't look any deeper, but I guess that means DATA is modeled on a per-loadout basis, too? It does make sense; an F-16 with a pair of Mk 84s isn't going to be as nimble as one with just Slammers and 'winders, after all. Or did I misunderstand that comment?

 

Last, but not least: I'm a troubleshooter by nature, so that's what keeps me coming back and asking questions. I'm the guy who can find the needle in the haystack. I'm not a coder, though. I can fix code, but I can't write it very well. I can tell you where the error is if I know the system, but writing a good and/or elegant fix isn't what I'm good at.

Actually, that brings me to a question: In HCE, do jammers set off ESM detection? i.e. can you detect/locate the jammer from its emissions? Or is that not modeled?

We get by on a technicality here . The active jamming doesn't work unless the jamming platform's radar is turned on so you get ESM detects of the jamming platform but not the jammer itself. Same difference

.

 

Ah, I didn't look any deeper, but I guess that means DATA is modeled on a per-loadout basis, too? It does make sense; an F-16 with a pair of Mk 84s isn't going to be as nimble as one with just Slammers and 'winders, after all.

Yep, there is a DATA value for each loadout that does indeed dock you for lugging around a bunch of weapons. The game used to automatically jettison weapons of planes that knew they were being attacked, hopefully we'll be able to turn that on again someday (at least for multiplayer as a hotkey. of course I'm not sure the hotkey doesn't work {I don't recall what the hotkey is/was atm, someone else might}).

 

Last, but not least: I'm a troubleshooter by nature, so that's what keeps me coming back and asking questions. I'm the guy who can find the needle in the haystack. I'm not a coder, though. I can fix code, but I can't write it very well. I can tell you where the error is if I know the system, but writing a good and/or elegant fix isn't what I'm good at.

Pretty much the same here, alpha tester->beta tester->minor programmer->agh-everyone else bailed now I'm the programmer. I have written some good and elegant code for the game and much in my professional life but at heart I'm a hardware guy (as in resistors, capacitors, and transistors). But alas the need for hardware in small business was much less than software and integration so I adapted.

We get by on a technicality here . The active jamming doesn't work unless the jamming platform's radar is turned on so you get ESM detects of the jamming platform but not the jammer itself. Same difference

 

Its clunky, but workable.

Tony says ESM detects out to a maximum of 1.1 times the radar's line of sight.

 

Ah, good. Since radar range due to LoS (Earth's curvature effect) from high to ground is about 250 nm, we can now say that ESM could pick up the plane at about 275 nm. Add 25 nm for the attached ground units.

 

Therefore, if the radiating Hawkeye at high altitude is within 300 nm of either Vietnamese base proper, then it will be detected by ESM. Further away, it is below the horizon.

 

So, what's the deal when I park the Hawkeyes out there 300 nm or more, with their radars left OFF?

 

I dunno, it seems a bit much to me, but I guess I wouldn't feel so bad if my side could also use blind ESM to do similarly effective intercepts at similar distances.

Last, but not least: I'm a troubleshooter by nature, so that's what keeps me coming back and asking questions. I'm the guy who can find the needle in the haystack. I'm not a coder, though. I can fix code, but I can't write it very well. I can tell you where the error is if I know the system, but writing a good and/or elegant fix isn't what I'm good at.

Pretty much the same here, alpha tester->beta tester->minor programmer->agh-everyone else bailed now I'm the programmer. I have written some good and elegant code for the game and much in my professional life but at heart I'm a hardware guy (as in resistors, capacitors, and transistors). But alas the need for hardware in small business was much less than software and integration so I adapted.

I can relate to that!