Was there an AAR on IOPG 8.0 Regional Power?

This is Bangladesh, Thailand, and Indonesia against India in the Bay of Bengal.
The blue side seems so hopeless I wonder if anyone ever played this through?

Here is how it went this time.

---------------------------------------------------

Blue forces are about 30-35 surface units, few old British and Chinese built frigates, some 25 PTMs assigned to 6 surface groups, two Indonesian Type 1300s submarines and 16 Super Puma helicopters from the Indonesian AFB, Sabang.
Two groups, AAs and ABs are postioned 100nm east of Calcutta, ACs, PTMs only, are in the Palk Straight between India and Sri Lanka, the rest is scattered south of the Andaman Islands.

Since no units posses any AAW capability to speak off all groups go strict EMCON, those few that have shipborne helos send out pickets, the rest of the groups split the fastest craft, usually a PTM, from the main group and send it out to scout in the hope that they can at least detect submarines by outrunnig torpedos.

At 0/00:01 group AAs and ABs detects ESM recon Tu-95 taking of from Calcutta, they are well in detection range of the Big Bulge AS and are soon painted by radar. They go active and both groups turn directly to Calcutta in the hope that they can at least engage targets before the inevitable.
AA02 PTM Hegu "Duranta" is the fastest PTM, the fleet commander orders it to leave the group East-South-East at flank speed under strict EMCON after transferring the logbooks of the rest of the ships on board in wetbags.

At 0/00:05 AB00 "Ali Haider" detects small a/c on 254 degrees at 48 nm, Sea Harriers!!
The group is doomed without even a chance to go down fighting, the crews say farwell to each other.
At 0/00:09 group detects missile contacts at 255 degrees at 14nm.
0/00:10 two Sea Eagles impact on Hainan "P817" and it sinks.
the same minute AB00 "Ali Haider" is hit by 4 missiles and sinks.
0/00:11 AB07 "Tawfiq" is hit and sinks.
The Devanāgarī is relentless, group AAs is also under attack by Sea Harriers.
0/00:39 AA00 "Abu Bakr" is hit and goes under.
And so it goes, all ten ships are sunk in quick succession.

Meantime PTM "Duranta" is some 15nm SE of the, now, debris field, doing 38knots, even the ligths are turned off but there is a violent row on the bridge, the XO histerically demands the captain every minute that their radars must go active since the Big Bulge is still painting them. Finally the CO need to pull a gun on him and XO is carried off the bridge, captain knows full well that their only chance if rough seas somehow hide them in clutter while they make it out of range of the Calcutta Harriers.
But even the cool head of their captain can't save them, two Sea Eagles impact on the hull out of nowhere
at 0/00:50 and "Duranta" goes under in 10 seconds, CO and XO finally find their peace.
There are no blue units left in the Northern half of the Bay.

Then boring hours come punctuated by sheer terror
AT 0/07:10 a cadet on AM00 "Udomet" spots a missile at 2nm, the crew bairly has time to radio bearing of the missiles to the commander of ADs for which it was running scout picket before it is hit by two Styx missiles and sinks.
ADs send send their single Sea Lynx down the bearing and soon discover 3 OSA I attack boats. Two Harpoons are launched on each and they are sunk.

 

--------------------------------------------------

 

However at this time I had 19 surface units left and Minimum Victory condition 1 is to have 20 ships on station in the Bay for 120 hours, so I rather start to search for an AAR on this scenario.

Anyone?

Can't say I recall ever having seen an AAR for this particular scenario.

After loading it and looking at it w/o time to play, it looks like you may want to ferry pumas with exocets to the groups in reach, and let them do some of the finding. Won't help you up north by the carriers, but can help you down south.

Not even that, the pumas can't ferry anywhere, I just looked up the DB, the Super Puma requires a Large Helipad and none of the ships (frigates mostly) have that. Naah, blue is doomed.

Are there any radars on the helos that are already aboard? Even a visual detection by a helicopter and an OTH Harpoon launch is better than both boats seeing the other.

 

I'll have to look at this scenario in the next week.

 

I'll have to check, but I don't think there are any air-to-air assets for the Indians except the Harriers from the CV. Pretty sure a quick look didn't show any fighters on the airbases, just search a/c.

 

There's not very many of them, so if you pull them out of position chasing helos, they can't go after the group up north.

 

TL;DR Any way of finding enemies that doesn't involve simultaneous exposure of your assets to the enemy is the key. He who can shoot w/o being seen wins.

 

Possibly Scenedit and give yourself a couple old sub-hunters of some kind. P-2s? I don't know, I'd have to look at what would be plausible for the countries involved. Also, do the Pumas have radars? or ESM sensors? You can see a surface radar a long way with ESM.

Are there any radars on the helos that are already aboard? Even a visual detection by a helicopter and an OTH Harpoon launch is better than both boats seeing the other.

 

Yes, the Lynx carries the "Sea Spray" SS radar, 40nm range.

But...

Most blue ships have only Exocets, 23nm, not really OTH weapon.

The stronges groups have two ships with Harpoons, 16 total.

One of these managed to maneuver in range of CVH Viraat,

after the Lynx id.ed them launched all the poons on the CVH.

No chance, the Viraat's four quad SA-N-9 launchers easily dispatched them

with the two Kashin IIs occasionally taking a bite for sport.

 

I'll have to check, but I don't think there are any air-to-air assets for the Indians except the Harriers from the CV. Pretty sure a quick look didn't show any fighters on the airbases, just search a/c.

 

There is CVH Viraat in the North just below Calcutta with 16 Harriers.

CVH Vikrant and CVA Cochin is entering the Bay via Sri Lanka. The Cochin carries 16 Yak-141 Freestyles!

The second group has less then 100% probability to be included.

There are also Tu-95Ds and 4 Il-38s in Calcutta and 6 ASW Alize in Port Blair.

 

There is one blue ship with 8 Aspide SAM and one with a few SeaCats, the rest can only use guns for AA.

I even tried to "ambush" an Alize with SeaCats

This Alize was studiously lugging AS.12 rockets in pairs on my group from Port Blair.

The AS.12 has 4.2nm range SeaCat is 3nm.

I split off the SeaCat ship from the group and sent it 3nm north towards Port Blair with radars off and turned them on only when Alize was in range attacking the main group. It launched 2 cats but could not get a hit. On an Alize!

 

Possibly Scenedit and give yourself a couple old sub-hunters of some kind. P-2s? I don't know, I'd have to look at what would be plausible for the countries involved. Also, do the Pumas have radars? or ESM sensors? You can see a surface radar a long way with ESM.

 

Yeah, well, we know these classic scenarios are not balanced and I accept them as "real" the way they come from the box.

Still, against the computer AI, you see a way to win usually.

Here? Perhaps hiding 20 ships in the bottom right corner of the map and chase the Indian subs with your subs?

The order text is fair enough:

 

You must try to stop India from militarily dominating the Bay of Bengal. While we are outclassed, a determined fight might encourage intervention by the western nations and give us leverage in the inevitable United Nations negotiations.

 

just don't see a way to preserve 20 ships in a determined fight agains these odds.

Ok. I Cheat. Go to scenario editor and look at the existing Victory conditions

For Red Minimum Victory:AND of 4 conditions: 16 ships any on station - all of Bay of Bengal. base remains on station, Sink 1 sub, and 1 Carrier on station - On station for 120 hours.

For Red total victory - AND of sink 2 subs, 8 of own subs remain on station 120 hours.

For Blue Minimum Victory- AND of - sink 2 subs, 20 (blue) ships on station, 2 subs on station =130 hours, all of bay of bengal

 

Deny blue from sinking Subs.

Last of the Red Min victory - You don't have a carrier to keep on station, cannot do it.

 

pardon my english- adequate fact, overly brief, you may have tio re-read and think it thru to get the full message.

ON occasion orders do not match the scenarios set victory conditions, and on other occasions, there are other impossible victory conditions set.

 

You might play to end as a draw, but cannot win over the Carrier thing.

Last of the Red Min victory - You don't have a carrier to keep on station, cannot do it.

Not sure what scenario you're looking at.

 

Red has two or three carriers in the scenario. Vikrant/Cochin group starts somewhere around the horn of India, and the Viraat group starts out in the Bay of Bengal.