sanderson Posted January 7, 2016 Report Share Posted January 7, 2016 Great work, Tony! Glad to see that you and all the staff here are still working for harpoon and try to make it better! But, personally speaking, I wish the ANW could also be updated, to fix the bugs and add more new features if possible. PS. I saw there are some players who play CMANO request the programmers to modify the game so that it can be connected with STK, just like Harpoon Pro(or Harpoon MilSim). What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted January 7, 2016 Report Share Posted January 7, 2016 Hi sanderson, I moved your post since it spanned a number of topics, only one of which was related to patching HCE to the current version of HC. Thanks for the pat on the back, much appreciated There was certainly a window before AGSI left the scene for ANW to be picked up by the community. I don't know if there is still a possibility of picking up the code. I didn't and don't have the time to pursue that. My opinion is that if you want an updated ANW, buy CMANO. The early builds to me play like a carbon-copy of ANW with a prettier interface. Since the early releases they've differentiated quite a bit (money and community will do that!). My interest in picking up the ANW codebase would have been to achieve more stable MP play. If CMANO hasn't achieved some integration with STK yet (and ArcGIS for that matter, not to mention pure defense contractor capabilities) I would be surprised. For individual users I don't think STK integration is key but if a military or defense contractor finds it attractive enough to commit to a buy then why wouldn't you integrate? There is only so much money in the gamer market for "our" games but the defense market is relatively unlimited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanderson Posted January 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2016 Hi sanderson, I moved your post since it spanned a number of topics, only one of which was related to patching HCE to the current version of HC. Thanks for the pat on the back, much appreciated There was certainly a window before AGSI left the scene for ANW to be picked up by the community. I don't know if there is still a possibility of picking up the code. I didn't and don't have the time to pursue that. My opinion is that if you want an updated ANW, buy CMANO. The early builds to me play like a carbon-copy of ANW with a prettier interface. Since the early releases they've differentiated quite a bit (money and community will do that!). My interest in picking up the ANW codebase would have been to achieve more stable MP play. If CMANO hasn't achieved some integration with STK yet (and ArcGIS for that matter, not to mention pure defense contractor capabilities) I would be surprised. For individual users I don't think STK integration is key but if a military or defense contractor finds it attractive enough to commit to a buy then why wouldn't you integrate? There is only so much money in the gamer market for "our" games but the defense market is relatively unlimited. Glad to see your reply! First, I'm sorry for interrupting your topics yesterday. In my opinion to the ANW edition, there are two reasons why I'd like it to be updated: 1) The MP mode! That would be the most wonderful feature, for we can only play the SP scenarios in CE or CMANO.(but there seems to be a tool on baloogancampaign.com, is that true?) You must understand that there are so many boardgame players who are not willing to play the pc wargames, for many wargames lack the function to interact with friends, not to mention the modern naval wargames because there are much less naval wargames than other topics(like the ww2). 2) I remember that you told me the rules of harpoon mostly come from the Harpoon 3, 4, and 5. So, for the people who play the Harpoon4 in our groups, the harpoon series may be better, compared to the blackbox of CMANO.(just my own viewpoint, what's your opinion?) Now as for the STK, I would say it's not my point to urge them to develop such a feature, but from some of the other wargamers in my grops! Haha! Except for the games, what they talk about most is the latest data of new weapon, new radar, new aircrafts and so on. Some of them seem going to do some simulations by STK!!! I think they are running away from the core of wargames, from the tactics and operations of naval warfare. Some people also held the idea that the electrical warfare has changed the war so much, and it's more important to study the electrical device in military. It seems like I digressed so much! Anyway, the support for STK in CMANO will be better, right? (ps. sorry for my poor skills of english... ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CV32 Posted January 8, 2016 Report Share Posted January 8, 2016 I remember that you told me the rules of harpoon mostly come from the Harpoon 3, 4, and 5. So, for the people who play the Harpoon4 in our groups, the harpoon series may be better, compared to the blackbox of CMANO.(just my own viewpoint, what's your opinion?) This is also just my own viewpoint, of course, but any multiplayer game that can combine the best of both worlds from human decision making and automated game play (whether by paper rules or a computerized sim) will always be better than a single player vs AI sim. No matter how excellent the sim (and CMANO would certainly rank up there in terms of warfare sims), it simply cannot match the dynamics of a multiplayer game like that described above. So, IMHO, a game that uses a solid set of rules (e.g. Harpoon 4) and relies upon human decision making/ingenuity is far superior. (The biggest issue is being able to coordinate game play among individuals and anchor their commitment to finishing the effort). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted January 8, 2016 Report Share Posted January 8, 2016 Well said Brad! sanderson, if you haven't tried out SimPlot yet, give it a whirl. KMart494 has made rapid progress. I hope to combine efforts someday! As for your gaming group, I agree that they won't be happy with anything short of a situation where a human can intervene so they are after play-aids more than a complete game with rather fixed rules. Every sensor can be replaced in HC via ExportDLLs (plugins) as can movement and a ton of other stuff but I bet they'll still be happier with Simplot, STK, and the like (play aids). I certainly dream bigger than that answer but at present that is the reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanderson Posted January 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2016 So, IMHO, a game that uses a solid set of rules (e.g. Harpoon 4) and relies upon human decision making/ingenuity is far superior. Totally agree. Many friends of mine and me think there are two features which are extremely important in a successful pc wargame: 1) The open rules of the game. Just like the Panzer Campaigns series of HPS, their mannuls provide almost all the formula and rules on moving, firing, artillery support, air support and so on. This feature enables players to play as the same way they played in the boardgames. They told me, with the aid of open rules, they could know which errors are caused by the misunderstand of rules, and which are caused by their limited tactics knowledge. 2) The support of MP mode, no matter pbem or online, just as we discussed above. The real battle is a process of conflict between people and people, not people and machines!(Except the robot war! ) That's why we still here playing ANW! Hoping one day there will be a new naval wargame which satisfies the two points above, and also good in simulation! BTW, is there any player who is trying to seek for an opponent to play ANW with online? Maybe I will get some spare time during the Chinese Spring Festival! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanderson Posted January 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2016 sanderson, if you haven't tried out SimPlot yet, give it a whirl. KMart494 has made rapid progress. I hope to combine efforts someday! Do you mean the Simplot tool in the "Paper Rules (Harpoon 4)" section? My friends have slready applied this excellent tool in their Harpoon4 wargaming. I can report any suggestions to the author asap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanderson Posted January 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2016 So, IMHO, a game that uses a solid set of rules (e.g. Harpoon 4) and relies upon human decision making/ingenuity is far superior. People play boardgames also hope that there wil be more pc wargames which are rebulit from the successful boardgames(like the ASL series). They think this is another way developers could consider to make a successful pc wargame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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